Episode 116: The Suffering of A Warrior with Earl Granville

Earl Granville, a combat wounded veteran was two weeks into in boot camp at Ft Benning with his twin brother Joe, when 9/11 happened. On his final tour, he lost his left leg through the knee to a roadside bomb while on patrol.

He is currently working with many non-profits such as Operation Enduring Warrior, the Oscar Mike Foundation and Warrior Strong. These 501c3s help keep wounded and disabled veterans and law enforcement physically active after their injuries. 

After becoming an amputee and the passing of his brother Joe, who took his own life while they were serving on active duty back in 2010, Earl now spends most of his time traveling the country as a public speaker. Discussing healthy ways to battle adversity, through the positivity in his messaging, real life solutions from his own experiences and participating as an inspiration and motivating force through psychical fitness challenges and marathons across the country.

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Transcript

Kevin Donaldson: 0:00

This is gonna hurt. It's time for the suffering podcast. Navigating through this life as a difficult task, we try to avoid the pitfalls and dangers along the way. Sometimes we take a detour to the right, or the left thinking that it's the right decision. Often we end up in a place that we're not supposed to be, chaos ensues, and we're thrown into a situation we cannot believe is happening. Our instincts kick in, and we must continue moving forward. one split second can change the entire trajectory of our lives. When the hazard has passed, and we come out, we're missing a piece of ourselves, that we may never get back, wondering if we will ever be whole again. It's all up to you whether you merely survive or thrive. I'm Kevin Donaldson here with Mike fleece and on this episode of the suffering podcast, we welcome Earl Granville to discuss the suffering of a warrior or always had to fight his way back and he keeps moving forward every single day. Thank you so much for wearing that beautiful hat in here today.

Mike Failace: 1:08

Go Eagles Go Eagles. You know, I was just gonna say I'm outnumbered. I mean, I got two ugly guys and one good looking Eagles a couple of

Kevin Donaldson: 1:16

weeks ago you were looking real ugly on a bad day to be a Giants fan.

Mike Failace: 1:20

Before we get started. I gotta say I read up on your I'm not worthy. And you are but we'll get into it but

Kevin Donaldson: 1:27

so URLs example is going to tell all of our audience to be an Eagles fan. But before we get into anything, let's get into our marquee sponsor. That's Toyota of Hackensack. We don't trust anybody, but we do trust Toyota of Hackensack go to Toyota hackensack.com and let them find your car. But don't forget to let them know that the podcast sent you. So Earl, you traveled all this way to come see us. And I thank you so much for everything. I've been like Mike, I read a lot of stuff about you. I love watching your Instagram. I love watching your social media because you never stop.

Unknown: 1:58

Well, I appreciate the invite in Hey, life is good. What can I say? Man, you know, throw in some bad cards, you know, you're dealt a bad hand. You just got to play those cards, right?

Mike Failace: 2:06

Gotta play the card. They hand you're dealt, right. Yep, exactly.

Kevin Donaldson: 2:09

I always say that I won more with seven deuce than I did with pocket aces. And that's the truth I lost many times a pocket aces are each week we take a question from our audiences, our social media question. And this week's question comes from Jonathan B. says, what was the best lesson you learned in your younger life? I'm gonna pass this one off to you since you're our guest today.

Unknown: 2:29

Somebody they didn't express this to me. But this person who's asked me this question, it was asked to them at one point and hearing their story. And I'm not even worthy to tell it but they were asked, What will your legacy be? And that kind of stuck with me a little bit? Like what are you going to leave this world after you pass away? And it's funny, I just listened to an audio all just driving I do a lot. Everything is audiobooks. And I listened to a book this subtle art of not giving a F

Kevin Donaldson: 3:04

not Yes, I read that book. I know exactly the book, say the subtle art of not giving enough.

Unknown: 3:09

Yep. And then he talks about legacy in that book. And after hearing reading that book and hearing that and like, so just think about that reflect on your life. What is your legacy gonna be? And I thought to myself, you know, I tried to give my legacy now. I hopefully, if I pass away, if I kick the bucket right now, on the right home, I get hit by a truck or something. Right? I want to wait till you

Mike Failace: 3:33

leave here because my CPR card is not up to coat. If you're gonna pass out, you know, make sure you're inside somewhere and know

Kevin Donaldson: 3:39

this. This will not have a little lower third in there. In Memoriam of Earl Graham.

Unknown: 3:46

Yeah, let's not jinx it.

Kevin Donaldson: 3:49

And you got to live long enough because at the time of this recording in a week and a half, the Eagles are gonna win the Super Bowl, so I hear it absolutely

Unknown: 3:57

right. You're gonna be in Texas, so watch that so Oh, that's gonna be fun. Oh my goodness. I'll be wearing this. I'm sure the Cowboys fans are gonna really hate it. But hey, get lost

Kevin Donaldson: 4:05

while they're there. No, don't worry about Cowboys fans.

Unknown: 4:09

Oh my god. No. This ain't the 90s guys are ticket hike, right? Yeah.

Kevin Donaldson: 4:14

They're cheerleading. Mike, what do you think?

Mike Failace: 4:16

I'm gonna watch the game down in Philadelphia. So it's a big eagle fan. Take a trip down 95 done a Broad Street. But you know, and you're gonna get a kick out of this. But one of the biggest lessons I ever learned is my father told me never quit. You know, and, again, I'm gonna bring up the Chuck Wepner thing.

Kevin Donaldson: 4:37

Again with the Chuck Wepner thing. Come on everybody. Let's

Mike Failace: 4:39

not bring up to chuck. I'm trying to get back in good graces. I'm trying

Kevin Donaldson: 4:43

to forget that incident.

Mike Failace: 4:44

No, like I said Chuck Wepner my father we said he's not he's not the best fighter in the world. But he never quits. He goes in there just keeps punching away and punches way takes us beaten, keeps getting back up and keeps going. He said you're never gonna. He didn't know how good I'd be. But he said you're never going to be the best at what you do. Just keep pushing and try to be the best. And that's pretty much what gets you through every day. You know, just keep pushing, keep pushing, you're not gonna be the best at what you do is people going to be better than you at anything you do. But just keep pushing along and try to be the best that you can be.

Kevin Donaldson: 5:15

You know, oddly enough, are all my answer to this question sort of piggybacks on yours. I learned a lot of lessons from my grandfather growing up, he was just a very wise man and taught me everything I know about being a man. But one of the things he said to me and I didn't understand it until I got older, it's never turn your back on somebody and give them or allow them the opportunity to call you an asshole. All right? And if you think about that, it's what's your legacy gonna be when you leave a room? Or when you leave this world? What's your legacy gonna be? How are people going to remember you? How are people going to see you or view you? And it's odd that you said that because I'm, obviously we had this question before we started recording, and I'm thinking about my answer. And that's it. Well, yeah, that's a good one. That's, that's, that's a lesson that I believe is one of my best. Do I succeed every time and leaving leaving a room without people calling me so this guy calls me and so like, four times a day?

Mike Failace: 6:08

It's funny, I was gonna say, every time I walk out here, I'm like that. So?

Kevin Donaldson: 6:11

Yeah. Do I fail? Absolutely. But to piggyback on your answer, I keep getting up. And I keep trying. So Jonathan, thank you so much for that question. We look forward to all your questions, keep sending them in, and we will try to get on the air. So Earl, I, I've read a lot about you.

Mike Failace: 6:30

So where do we even start this?

Kevin Donaldson: 6:32

I want to I want to start, I want you to tell our audience a little bit about yourself, obviously, we're going to get into a pretty deep and dark story because we are on the suffering podcast. So it's an all in all sunshine and rainbows here. So why don't you tell our audience a little bit about yourself?

Unknown: 6:47

I just start somewhere in the beginning. Let's just say at the end of high school, I was I felt like I was a little punk. Like, literally like going to punk shows and dabbling guitar a little bit. And I think How old are you? 39? You're 30

Kevin Donaldson: 7:00

that okay, just I want to know what kind of punk era era you're talking

Unknown: 7:03

about. Yeah, just some friends of mine. In high school, they introduced me to punk genre and got a little venue called Cafe metropolis in Wilkes Barre, Pennsylvania. And no security there and a tiny little stage and just all this underground music, I guess you can call it that. And you know, no, bringing the man down and all stuff like that.

Mike Failace: 7:26

And mosh pits and all that. Oh

Unknown: 7:28

my goodness, that that I feel like that was my you know, my older, like my later high school days.

Mike Failace: 7:34

Like it's still me today.

Unknown: 7:37

I still love it, man. I still love it. Geez man. But um, with that being said, My twin brother in our senior year of high school reached out to me about joining some type of Armed Forces services. And my cousin Paul was as well and I so I'm joined in the military man like come on man to work for the man like work food government. And but I think what comes with that attitude sometimes it just plus how immature I was.

Mike Failace: 8:05

rebellious attitude when you're younger. Absolutely. It was an outlet. Yeah. Music was an outlet.

Unknown: 8:12

Oh, I loved it. And I still do today. She's man, it wasn't a myth. It's but it's like, there was an incentive that got me to join the military. And people would call whatever they want. And for me, it was free education. Oh, I don't have a scholarship. How am I going to pay for school GI Bill? Yeah, GI Bill and I and also at that time, and then going to school in the 90s everything was if you don't go to college, you'll never succeed in life. Anybody out there listening who you know, I graduated high school early 2000. So it's like if you I think we all heard it. If you don't go to get a four year education you'll never succeed in life and we all realize it's

Kevin Donaldson: 8:53

bullshit. Absolutely if you if you look at anything with like, micro micro foundation actually give scholarships people go into trade schools because the I forget this statistic you throw it it was like 70% of trade positions are going unfilled, which are like $75,000 or higher to start,

Mike Failace: 9:10

right? Yeah, I say it all the time. Yeah, I went to college for a year you know, but uh, you know, back in the mid 80s When I graduated high school there wasn't such a premium on college as there is now 1015 years we're not gonna have any plumbers we're not gonna have any carpenters because everybody's got a college education now now where are we gonna go? And I

Unknown: 9:29

think because it everyone got a college education because we're all told we were we're not going to water it down. Absolutely. You know, it's a it's not supply and demand. So we really need those plumbers we need us carpenters. We need all those blue collar jobs that I feel like society for such a long time looked down upon well, so

Kevin Donaldson: 9:47

blue collar jobs. Him and I were both police officers. We were blue collar jobs. Police salaries in New Jersey were relatively high. So where you have somebody like we'll take car sales, you have a car salesman policeman Making more than a car salesman yet a car salesman is seen as a white collar job. So it's it's perception. It's really really perception. So

Mike Failace: 10:06

even before law enforcement, I was in a pipe fitters union. I was always I left college I started working right away. I was a blue collar guy my whole life. You know? I didn't, I don't want to say I mean need College, though. You needed it? Well, I

Unknown: 10:19

do. Don't get me wrong in December. I finished up school. I got my undergrad.

Kevin Donaldson: 10:24

You finished it with different eyes than an 18 year old.

Unknown: 10:28

Oh, absolutely. Like I what I do. Now, you if you told me this was been my life when I was 18. I don't mean like get lost. Yeah. But literally joining the military was because of college. You could say call it whatever you want. And I get you know, I was getting teased for it. Right? Yeah, whatever, man. I joined for something. But I feel moving forward. You know, things obviously changed. Joe and I graduated high school. And brother's name was Joe. Yes. My twin brothers, brother. Yep. Twin brother Joe. We graduated high school and we had a good summer and we landed basic training at Fort Benning, Georgia. And the date was September 1 2001. I don't have to tell you what happened 11 days later, and I was in

Kevin Donaldson: 11:12

the police academy when they happen. Yeah.

Unknown: 11:14

And I just thought I always thought to myself, let's just say our shipping date was September 12. Would I have gone? Oh, I don't want to do this anymore in order to be like, Well, I'm you know, so

Kevin Donaldson: 11:22

when you were that's a good point, because I had this similar situation when I was in a police academy. You know, I I remember to this day, you know, Captain, his name is Captain Jack. He came in and he said plane just hit the World Trade Center, which isn't a big deal because it happened all the time. When the second one hit you like shit, yes, this is no accident. And you you're joining some sort of life of service in peacetime thinking, hey, this is a college thing, right? And now you you're looking at, like, how did your perception change? Oh, absolutely.

Unknown: 11:50

You gotta remember, we joined the National Guard. All those commercials growing up. What are we gonna move two weeks a year? And my life completely shifted like, it's, but

Kevin Donaldson: 12:03

now it's you're going to war? Yeah, right.

Unknown: 12:05

And it's, there's, there's absolutely no thought that all we're not going to send us over NASCAR is like, Oh my God, look what just happened the second time ever in history. Like our nation was under attack. You know, we all know what happened. December 7 1941. So yeah, exactly. So it's just a big wake up call. And, you know, and look, we're going to Tarantino looking at everything right now. I don't regret any of it. I really don't. I just was an immature kid at that time. Did that

Mike Failace: 12:36

like motivate you at that point that it gives you more like American pride saying, I'm part of this

Unknown: 12:42

now? Absolutely. Because you didn't it didn't really know. Honestly, God, I'm telling you. I just had that bad attitude. I remember looking at Joe just like we're in basic training together and it's just like, don't get

Mike Failace: 12:54

me what's your we could be at a punk show right now.

Unknown: 12:58

You know, and he hated that stuff. I was like, God, we are the worst twins ever.

Kevin Donaldson: 13:01

So there was a there was a funny story. My grandfather was he was telling me he had a bunch of problems. He had five brothers. And after Pearl Harbor, they all went down to join it because actually the story is is they all got drunk and one of their brother Bill all talked him into going down and joining the army. Well, they all got accepted. And Bill got rejected. Oh no, she in one fort my poor uncle. He became a prisoner of war for 27 months in Germany so he always sort of held it against my Uncle Bill. I'm sure you held it against your brother in some form or fashion when it was going on.

Mike Failace: 13:38

He probably knew there's something wrong going on where he couldn't get in. He got flat feet are colorblind

Unknown: 13:44

Yeah, joke's on you guys.

Kevin Donaldson: 13:47

See you have fun to do Have fun storming the castle. I'm gonna go back to the bar. Oh yeah, that's what it was storming White Castle. But yeah, the world changed on September 11 That change for everybody changed everybody's mindset. When did the military start to be something that you got a little used to

Unknown: 14:13

basic training? Yeah, to get used to it. So I mean, it definitely started there. But I think the bad attitude was still there. Like I'm here now and there's little things like that first PT test. It took a basic training everybody bombed it, you know, not everybody but I remember I definitely pawned it and like just

Kevin Donaldson: 14:30

always that one guy who did who out did everybody like me?

Unknown: 14:33

Oh my god. Yes. Cheese guy. His last name was caps. That ca PPS, I believe is how you spell. And right off the bat. He's just smoking everybody and like cheese, man, you know, and like, I'm thinking to myself, Oh, we're gonna homeschool. Like I just won. Did I ever run two miles before? You know what I mean? Like so it is what it is. But that's, that's the military they build you up and that's exactly what they did.

Mike Failace: 14:58

They break it down in order to build Oh, yes.

Kevin Donaldson: 15:01

Which I love, which I didn't, I didn't realize that until I got into the police academy, that it's a game. It's a big game, it's I'm going to break you down as individuals and I build you up as a team. Oddly enough, it's what I do to the kids that I coach and coach, you sports, I build, I break them down, if I'll pick out the individuals, and I break them down, I break them. And then I build them back up, and I let them build each other up as a team. And it's something it's a lesson I never forgot.

Unknown: 15:25

Absolutely true. And you learn a lot about yourself, you know, and it's, Hey, I never thought I would ever shoot, you know, 38 out of 40 targets with a rifle. I never thought I would be running two miles in 13 minutes and 20 seconds. You know, little stuff like that. You just learned so much about yourself if you actually embrace it. And that's what I started to do in basic training. And I think everybody does that. Like that's nothing like out of the ordinary, well, you

Kevin Donaldson: 15:54

unlock certain things inside your mind that you're it's not possible until it's possible. It's like the four minute mile. Nobody thought that was physically human to run a four minute mile guy breaks it in, I think it was 56 that he breaks the four minute mile. And then within the next year, like 11 people broke it. Because it's possible takes one person it takes one person to break it. But inside yourself, you never thought you were capable of doing all that stuff. And then you do it. And you're like, Well, what am I leaving on the table here?

Unknown: 16:19

Exactly, you know,

Mike Failace: 16:20

and now you watch New York City Marathon in like the 21st and 22nd mile run five minute miles. It's like, Oh, you gotta be kidding me.

Unknown: 16:27

You know, so I just ran the New York City Marathon. And I gotta tell you, because of my injury, I get an early start. So when those elites run past us, it's like, oh, no, there's a car behind them with the camera and the whole world's watching it and like

Kevin Donaldson: 16:44

Were you one of those guys? Because I ran it and oh, six. Are you one of those guys that pissed off every bridge?

Unknown: 16:50

No, I was not. But now I got a goal. There's a

Kevin Donaldson: 16:52

group. So there's six bridges. Yes. Alright, starts at the very end. zarnow. And throughout. There's a group of people. That's their mission to piss off of every bridge. And so you start on the Verrazano and you're like, This guy's got a piss already. It's like you just start and you feel the bridge. Like I had stage fright. So there's no way I'm pissing off a bridge. But these guys they hung trial off every single bridge.

Unknown: 17:15

Ski citrate man only

Mike Failace: 17:18

pissed off of every bridge of every bridge. I was because I'm pissed off all the while the bystanders

Kevin Donaldson: 17:26

it's a beautiful scene in the beginning because they got all the boats, the FDNY boats, they're shooting the colored water out and everything. And it's beautiful. And here's you look over Oh, look, there's got pets in there. You got this.

Mike Failace: 17:36

Just don't put on TV.

Kevin Donaldson: 17:39

Welcome to New York. But yeah, I saw someone who was elite guys in the pit. It was a hoot. It was a Peruvian guy. And they look like skeletons. I mean, in a move so fast. It's crazy. But yeah, it's an interesting experience. But that gets back to the point you ran. Now just so everybody knows. You have one leg. And you ran the New York City Marathon. So looking at the camera, I'm gonna say what are you leaving on the table? No kidding. What are you leaving on the table? This guy, one leg runs 26.2 miles.

Unknown: 18:14

And you know, this was my eighth marathon. And this is my PR. Finally, you know, it's look, I'm not the fastest guy out there, my other legs full of hardware. You know, I really train different for this one. Lot of salt tablets, this time to which because I think in the past grandparent parent, but uh, my goal I said to and I qualify for running guide. And basically, they're just out there for me to, Hey, you want to go run a marathon with me? You know, basically, that's pretty much they have a little fanny pack. The whole stuff if I needed like a wrench for my prosthetic, or whatever it may be. And I said, Well, you told me

Kevin Donaldson: 18:47

you need a pit crew to run a marathon. There you

Unknown: 18:50

go. And

Mike Failace: 18:52

gets an oil change and like, Wow, 13 WD 40.

Kevin Donaldson: 18:57

Yeah, so but there's some challenges inside yourself. And when you run across that finish line. For me, when I ran across the finish line, it was very anticlimactic, like our retirements aren't Yeah. Like, like your retirement from the military. You think it's going to be this woohoo moment. And it's kind of like, Okay, what's next?

Unknown: 19:15

Yeah, yeah, definitely. You can see that, you know, I just I, from my immediate family, I'm the only one that got a bachelor's and I just got my bachelor's. Finally, I'm 39 years old, but it's like, no one.

Kevin Donaldson: 19:30

You got to update your website because it says you're pursuing. Oh, really? Well, what would you do when you're in the military? Let's get back to the military. When you're near When did you get? You go through basic training? Right. And you find out you're getting shipped out? Correct. All right. Yeah. So is that when you got your real first taste of war?

Unknown: 19:48

Well, my first tour was Bosnia. And if you read the book, Love thy neighbor by Peter moss. I read that before I went over there you understand why NATO forces were in Bosnia in 92. Didn't it five huge

Kevin Donaldson: 20:02

Slobodan Milosevic? Was that was that the days of him?

Unknown: 20:05

Yes. And they, and the genocide that was happening in that part of the world. And three years of that going on NATO forces stepped in while this has to stop. But the time we got there, read the book, by the way, anybody out there if you're unfamiliar with the Bosnian conflict, but the time we got there in 2002, there was no real threat, then NATO forces is more peacekeeping. So that was nice, easy deployment, first time ever leaving the country. And I was 19 when I got boots on ground. And it was just an experience, there was some masquerade sites and, and learning from the locals that are interpreters that we worked with every day of exactly what the Bosnian people are, the lot of Muslims are facing over there. You know, that book, it's like about, like you and I could be neighbors all this time. And then all of a sudden, you just start slaughtering my family. And I don't mean just like go in and shoot them all up. I mean, just horrific. torture and rape it. It's, it's while reading that book, like, you know, just be advised It's heavy. It's it may it made, made me understand why we were there. And came back from that deployment. Like I said, we're National Guard. So I started getting that education after returning from Bosnia, and it was the Lackawanna College got two semesters in and we got to we got a warning order for Iraq, but it was a volunteer mission, the way the National Guard worked at the time, you have to be home for so long before you are told to deploy again, I don't know the exact timeline or dates, or, and when I returned, or return from Bosnia, I was like, oh, man, my contract will be overdone. Like, for four more years. So in this Warning Order happened. I was like, it was volunteer, like, I'm not gonna go. But Joe really wanted to go. And I thought, man, God forbid, if something happens. Yeah, you know, and it just maybe I should go as well. And it seems like everybody that I knew on that Bosnia tour, was volunteering prior rack, like cheese, you know, maybe I should go to it's not even just my brother. But he was a big one. And my cousin Paul, I think those two were like the big guys, I should go as well.

Mike Failace: 22:25

Because if you didn't go to talk about it.

Kevin Donaldson: 22:29

But like you said, God forbid something happened, and you're not there. Do you imagine living with that regret Exactly.

Unknown: 22:36

Here and partying in a college and you get that knock on the door? You get that phone call? Like, I don't want to fuck with you with that, you know,

Kevin Donaldson: 22:43

I'd rather be in country I guess I guess I'm theorizing I'd rather be in country. If something were to happen, at least I feel like I'm conduced I can do something.

Mike Failace: 22:52

Right, you know, a helplessness when you're not there. Exactly.

Unknown: 22:55

And I think too, it's man, I gotta tell you, it's just something about that Iraq deployment, because obviously I did go. Yeah, you could tell him getting up to that. But, um, and it was the best decision I ever made. You know, I became an NCO became a sergeant. So I've taken on that those leadership roles, learning more about myself, taking on that responsibility

Kevin Donaldson: 23:16

dealing with young punks like us.

Unknown: 23:18

helps. Yeah. But you know, I back I think it was like three or four months in the network. I got promoted to sergeant. And yeah, I started taking those roles of vehicle commander and yeah, it's but it was a people I was with, it made me see see, I wanted to think about this. I joined the military for me. What can I get out of this? Going into Iraq? I saw the big picture. This isn't about me. It's about us.

Mike Failace: 23:43

There's almost a selfish choice at first, we're going for myself, you know,

Unknown: 23:47

you nailed it right there.

Mike Failace: 23:47

What are they gonna give me what were they

Kevin Donaldson: 23:49

when you were over in Iraq? What were the common like, where did you stay? Did you were you in a tent? Where did you have pretty decent barracks? We lived in like, oh, like Quonset huts.

Unknown: 23:59

Quonset huts, cheeses.

Kevin Donaldson: 24:02

I know. I know what you're talking about. Yeah, there's

Unknown: 24:05

big trailers that like they. I can't I can't even think what they're freaking called now.

Kevin Donaldson: 24:11

But anyway, what we have to do, Mike is we have to get three three acres is one of our sponsors, their luxury condominiums in Jersey City. We got to get three acres to start designing the military barracks because that place is absolutely gorgeous.

Unknown: 24:23

Everybody's deployment is different. Like my unit was actually split in half the one on a temporary half we're in Ramadi. The other half were on our side. They split the battalion right in half. I was in Alside.

Kevin Donaldson: 24:35

Ramadi is where Chris Kyle was.

Unknown: 24:36

Yep. Yeah. Ramadi. Was that double Ramadi? Yep. And a lot of my friends were in Ramadi. Our deployments were completely different. Don't get me wrong, it's not like we saw danger. But they saw a lot more than we do. A B flat out like we my platoon we have one Purple Heart Gary C. Aiko, and his Purple Heart was there seven ton we were attached them are In car so we would use some of their vehicles and some of their weapons and they were in a seven ton they hit a roadside bomb and he was gunning the vehicle and it was he got a ruptured eardrum. Like back to work the next day. No big deal. Yep. Wow,

Kevin Donaldson: 25:15

did you see that roadside bomb by any chance? Did you see that your friend lost his hearing with Did you see it?

Unknown: 25:20

No. No, I was I was actually not on patrol that day. So it was like we didn't sometimes we didn't need everybody on the platoon. But uh, yeah, I mean when we heard it happen, and you know, what's the outcome is anybody hurt? And at the moment too, it's just that when they assess their injuries after they hit that you know, they realize one of zero drones ruptured that you qualify for being combat wounded his report player and you know and it's just like a lot of these minor and I look any injuries and injury right. And I would never downplay somebody's injury but Gary's like, he's like whatever Yeah, there was

Kevin Donaldson: 25:58

like a Purple Heart Medal was made during World War Two. So they made every Purple Heart and this is this is what I read this plenty of times every Purple Heart Medal that is given out today was made during World War Two in anticipation for the invasion of Japan because we know if we invaded Japan, we were gonna lose millions. Millions. So they started they started printing all these purple hearts, and they have so many in stock maybe it's different now because you know, we've had a 20 year war, but I don't think so. I think it's still really Yeah, I did not know that courageous like stupid stuff in my head. Like I know Slobodan because I actually almost name my first son Slobodan you know, it's a family name.

Mike Failace: 26:37

Kevin has a wealth of like, misinformation or you know, just a wealth of strength Wikipedia.

Kevin Donaldson: 26:43

I will distract you with stupid information.

Mike Failace: 26:46

He'll say something like when he says Slow down. Slow healthy.

Unknown: 26:52

My reaction has stopped but think for a second like yeah, that was like slow but I'm already watching it like,

Kevin Donaldson: 26:57

even pronounce it correctly. Even pronounced. I was so proud. I pronounce it correctly.

Mike Failace: 27:01

You were called Slow your whole life.

Kevin Donaldson: 27:03

So this route your deployment, you saw some crap. You saw

Unknown: 27:08

Yeah, it was it was minor to be honest with you. Like my first ever firefight was January 2006. And we're on Route Tampa going south. And we came to the security Hall and four vehicles were on a dirt road parallel to where we were, and they just started laying us up and we destroy the fuck out of them, like not one person was injured on our side. Three vehicles we just completely destroyed and one actually got away but we had air support because it was long convoys we had, like 11 military vehicles and 5050 tractor trailers driven by third world nationals, right. So we need air support for stuff like this large so that one vehicle that got away air support took care of it. And that week is what I read out my contract. I'm not I'm not I'm not getting it and my gunner, he couldn't get a good view on those trucks.

Kevin Donaldson: 27:57

You need a little bit more time on your decisions, sir. That's the second bad decision. Thankfully, I

Unknown: 28:04

never thought of it that way.

Mike Failace: 28:07

Probably sat there and said this was cool.

Unknown: 28:10

I was like I was Why watch my buddy Bob Farrell. He was in the vehicle in front of me. And he was he had a 50 Cal, he was gunning, and it's 50 Cal jammed instead of trying to figure out how to fix it. He reaches inside JVC Terminator two. You know when we're at Skynet, and he kicks that kicks the desk out. And he starts shooting towards the cops with the mini gun and he runs out of bullets. And he pulls out an M 79. And he blows up the one cop car. That's exactly what Bob Farrell did. My buddy Farrell like, I'm not kidding. He took the Cal jams. Here comes a freakin Sunday and I'm one of the trucks that I was like, What the fuck am I watching right now? Like and I think why was it like you're just pumped up on adrenaline. We blew those trucks up and we just kept on going. That was it. Nobody got hurt. We there was nothing towards us. And it was just like, holy shit. Is this just happening now like my guys in Ramadi, my friends and remonte it was a much different deployment. Like August of 2005. One of the units take sniper fire and somebody gets killed. That's a staff sergeant Billy Ostrom. I was in Bosnia with the I didn't know Billy that well. But he was killed. Right? And then

Kevin Donaldson: 29:20

let's that's what Jocko Willink was he was a task unit bruiser. And he tells a great story it's they call it a wire because the wire you go outside of the wire, you're in danger. Yeah.

Unknown: 29:31

And then after that there was I'm leading up because there's a reason why I'm saying this then it was September 19 2005. Billy, avid specialist Billy Evans there he's he's a driver for Bradley Bradley fighting vehicle looks kinda looks like a tech track vehicle. And he's killed that action after hitting that roadside bomb. And then 11 days later, or I'm sorry, nine days later, September 28. It was a big one. Five gentlemen in the hunter ninth infantry A hit a white boxers ID outside of Romani. Staff Sergeant George Puglisi. Staff Sergeant Daniel Arnold. Sergeant Eric subbotnik. Specialist Lee Wiegand, mpfc. Oliver brown. Now,

Kevin Donaldson: 30:13

it's great that you say their

Unknown: 30:14

names, but absolutely you have to you have to man and it's just got to remember, I went on leave from Iraq, like we all got to weekly and we choose to take away one. Yeah, I'll go home for two weeks. And, and I gotta tell you, it's the community that we're National Guard now. Okay, this isn't seven people in an active duty unit. This is all from the same area, little North Eastern and Central Pennsylvania, all killed an action. What is this doing to a community? Yeah, that makes sense. Like, it's that much more impactful. And, yeah, it's just, it's heavy, heavy, you know, and I just said the story these guys like, Staff Sergeant George Puglisi, my before I came here, I have a little beater vehicle, and I need to drop it off at the garage. His nephew was a good friend of mine now. Justin Merrigan. Age, I call him off today as like Justin, would you follow me to garage and then bring him back to my house? So I could take my truck? To jersey? In? Absolutely. But like, you're friends with all these people that are my neighbors like their

Mike Failace: 31:19

past? I mean, we're all from a close knit world. Right? Not a close knit but a close area.

Kevin Donaldson: 31:24

Yes. So it was a different type of war. Because him and I remember Gulf War very, very clear. We were actually of age. And I think they lost like 12 people, something along those lines in the initial attack. It wasn't anything significant. And then we see this war. And I don't know about you, Mike. But this is the way I thought of it. I'm like, you know, we're going to just destroy him. We're going to, you know, turn it into glass and all that all those pro-american and out in a couple of weeks. Yeah, we'll be in and out in a couple weeks. And then you start seeing these, these deaths. And you start seeing it and you watch it, you start watching the news. And now all of a sudden, you get what the people in the Vietnam era, understood reading the papers looking for names. God, what a wake up call, you know,

Unknown: 32:03

it's never ending to It's crazy to think that these conflicts and I think one of the reasons to it's like, we're not fighting on government, we're not fighting. I mean, we took Saddam on a power, but we still have enemy. They're al Qaeda. And then when we pulled out, you know, isis just rolled right in. And in Afghanistan, we're dealing with the Taliban. And I mean, you got to remember the Russians lost to the Taliban in the 90s.

Kevin Donaldson: 32:26

So that's, that's an interesting question. And it's, it's not American politics, because we refuse to get involved in that, however, with Iraqi politics, when Saddam was caught, and when he was hung, I'm like, Yeah, all right, this guy's a son of a bitch. Let's hang him. In retrospect, it was probably the worst thing we ever did. That's my opinion, solely my opinion, because he was an animal. But so are these people that you're fighting right now? Right? Animals, and it takes an animal to govern an animal,

Unknown: 32:57

I want you to think about, here's how have you. In our culture here in America, you've probably know a million people with an American flag tattoos. Now, there's a reason why I'm saying this. Exactly. I see it right there. When you go over there, right. Well, first of all, why do we have these American flag tattoos pride that we have, let's just say somebody invaded America. And I don't mean like 911 or Pearl Harbor, like actually boots on the ground, like trying to evade Lower Manhattan. Right? I would maybe maybe Manhattan isn't a good example. But let's just say bumblefuck.

Kevin Donaldson: 33:36

Alabama, like a Red Dawn situation, right? Yeah.

Unknown: 33:40

It's, I don't think it's the military. I think it's the everyday people like you and me, that they should worry about,

Kevin Donaldson: 33:46

actually. So that's one of the things against getting American flag because then they see you coming. Yeah, that's, that's, you make a good point there. And I'm gonna have to cover this.

Unknown: 33:57

Well, my point is like long sleeves. There's so much pride in our country and the people we like, we love this country so much. And it's like the pocket us like, yeah, we have a big badass military, but our people too. There is no passion within the Iraqi people. There is no there is you'll never see somebody with an Iraqi flag tattoo or an Afghan tattoos. That makes sense. Yeah. That's why when ISIS came in the military after we gave the Iraqi military, we gave them all these weapons. We gave them fobs. We gave them vehicles. It just but they don't have the heart, like Americans do to fight for what's there. So that makes sense. And you know, I

Mike Failace: 34:34

think, I mean, they're there. They have to go in the military over there. It'll take.

Kevin Donaldson: 34:38

I think they're, I think they're conscripted. Like, you know, they used to call people during the Civil War conscripted. They weren't drafted. They were just like told yo, you're going in the fucking military.

Mike Failace: 34:47

So in United States, you know, we haven't had a draft in a while but people in our military went in there pretty much for the love of the country. It would I correlate that to these other countries where you're almost forced to go into the military, it's like going to college. Right? Right. So to them that's like college you know, you sit in college you guys were military that's where they were expected to go

Kevin Donaldson: 35:12

you know, there's there's something to that with Iraq, but then you have a nation like Israel and you have to go in the military in Israel. Israel's are very prideful of their country. So I think one respect you're right there is no like, you have to do it. It's just like a rite of passage. For Israelis. It's got to be the pride thing. It's got to be

Unknown: 35:32

there's a little bit and you know, these water downward as a saint, but there's a little bit of freedom over there in Israel. I think Saddam with that Iron Fist that he had, like, I love the movie. My favorite military movie ever is three kings. Oh, yeah. And when we it's like, Saddam will kill us. You know, you hear the Iraqi military sit down will kill us if they take you know, like, they're, they're living in fear over there. So now their dictator guy with the iron fist is gone. So we're going to think we're going to cure all of our tax problems by giving them democracy. Fuck now, I'm not going to do that. Like now. It's like I'm free. This country has done nothing for me, except rule me with an iron fist and tell him what to do. Or else they're going to kill my family. So why the hell what are they fighting for now? Now that's gone. You know what I mean? Now let's go on. So here comes ISIS rolling in. Fuck this. I'm out. You see what I mean? If you watched it, you watched it happen in Afghanistan, what? A year and a half ago, they say, when we pull out a Bagram before anything else, Bagram Air Base in Afghanistan, I was like, That's a fucking bad idea. I remember I remember reading that article before we had the initial pull of the rest of our military. But Bagram was like the I think every single human being that every American I could be wrong, but like, let's just say 90% of military probably all going to Bagram. It's the hub. Yeah, exactly. And it's, I mean, it's it. They looked at Bagram was like a big, huge military base, or rarely got attacked. You know, you're saluting which any place any other place in Afghanistan or Iraq, you don't salute it just you're in a war zone. But if you didn't wear your PT belt on Bagram, you're, you're gonna get a fine from the MP. It's like, it's, it's, it was like being a peacetime military. Right? It was like being in garrison was what we call it, you know, and, but because I think all the traffic going there, and how safe it was compared to all these other places. And once we pulled out of there, I thought, This isn't good. And then yeah, when we pulled our muscle out the US military and left are vulnerable there. I'm, I got an interpreter there right now. And it sucks, because I'm still trying to get him out of Afghanistan, but we pull our muscle out and left the vulnerable there. Instead of doing it reverse

Kevin Donaldson: 37:39

the three kings situation, you know, these people exact now you can think about that. Yeah. Now, you know, you can never go back in because you screwed these poor people who didn't help you when you were there. Yeah. So you're I want to get back to your deployment. Sure. All right, your deployment. At some point, it goes south for you

Unknown: 37:56

on this deployment. We ended up finishing and I came home. Right, this is this is Iraq. Right. Okay. Okay. So and I came home, I enrolled back into college, I got my two year degree at like, Lackawanna school, Lackawanna College. Then we got another Warning Order, another volunteer mission. And this was Afghanistan. And I raised my hand right away as like, Okay, I just finished college. I'm still got more education under my belt to use from the GI Bill. But where should I go next? What should I do? I was I was thinking about being a Scranton firefighter. Like, what's what's next. And then this deployment for Afghanistan came up, it was with a different battalion, the 103rd armor. They're looking for volunteers and like, I'll do that. Joe, on the other hand, he was gonna stay back. He's now married. And him and Stephanie, his wife, want to start a family. I get it, man. This is priority. Yeah. And he and Joe asked me not to go. I was like, Dude, we're gonna be going back to Iraq. Like a urine change for now with the 56 brigade, a different brigade in the Pennsylvania guard. We're gonna be attached to them. How about we just stay back and do that together and like, Sorry, dude, cut my car. And I went, and on this deployment to Afghanistan, we were called were part of what's called a provincial Rican Reconstruction Team, which is PRT for short. The PRT his job is we worked with locals in Afghanistan, local government, like small government, like village elders and mayors and stuff like that, helping rebuild parts of Afghanistan that the Taliban was trying ran and we were in the POC to Providence, in the capital, which is Gardez of this Providence. And a big thing we were doing over there is help renovate the hospital gardens with other projects to like building schools and we're just all over the Providence doing this stuff. My platoons job. We were the security force for the core PRT. That core PRT with civil affairs which had these one on one meetings with these look Government. We had us civilian engineer. So not even all of us were military. And it was a mix of branches as well. Like we worked a lot with the Air Force, my medic, Eric Jones, who was a tech sergeant in the Air Force. So very unique mission from anything I've done. And every person I got to, I got promoted to staff sergeant and we would, every person we would escort would be in the backseat of our Humvees or M wraps whatever we're driving that day. Every person except for one individual, this gentleman his name was Major Scott Haggerty, he's civil affair officer in the Army Reserves out of Stillwater, Oklahoma. He resides in Stillwater, Oklahoma, I believe his units in Texas though, and he just liked to be in charge of the vehicle he was in, he's in all four. He's a major and you know, whatever man, you want that job in the shotgun seat, bargainers have attitude. Tell you what I'm going to be your gunner. And I put my gunner Craig rains as a passenger in a different vehicle. Okay, this is a four day mission little town called Dormont. In eastern Afghanistan, looking at a sniper school. And the final day out there, we're looking at this site for where we're going to build a school. And we had to take a different route back to fob Gardez. I won't get too deep into reasons why, but less choking points. traveling faster on this new route we're taking was a route that we weren't familiar with. But looking at the maps, looking at our Blue Force tracker is anybody out there Blue Force tracker is like our electronic GPS and of vehicles. Looking at the map, we've seen a lot more safer, wider roads, just flying through it. Okay. And I remember being on the headset and saying to the crew, my vehicle only the people in my vehicle can hear me on the headset being that it was an gunners hat, and I just said, Who the heck's water in their grass in Afghanistan? Look how nice this is. Because this is, like I said, it's a new area. None of us are familiar with. But my first time any of us I believe, anyway, seeing this bright green vegetation in Afghanistan, like find this beautiful here, man. The next thing I remember, I saw nothing but black. You know, when you put your head under water, and what you're hearing when your head is underwater, that faint noise or like when you clog your ears with your fingers. Stuff like that. Yep. That's the best way to describe what I was hearing at that time. And I felt this momentum. I remember saying to myself, in my mind, just saying myself, feeling this tiny little momentum. fuck is going on right now. And finally, it was just a moment. When I came to Apple, my eyes, big beautiful sky. It's like 230 in the afternoon over there. Like Geez, why am I looking at Sky? Holy shit. I'm on the ground. Oh, my legs. My feet are backwards and full of blood. To the left of me, the Humvee is completely ripped to shreds. We just had a roadside bomb.

Kevin Donaldson: 43:09

Wow. You didn't hear any bang? No, no, you didn't.

Unknown: 43:13

I went from talking on that headset to everything I just described. Like, just like that. And the very next thing I heard was my buddy, Joe Voda. Yell, get them in a body bag. And I'm like, What the fuck is going on right now? All right, like then I just started assessing everything. Alright, I can't stand up. I don't have a working weapon on me. Get them in a body bag. We're not under attack because I don't hear gunfire. The pucks going on people are killed. Is it awesome? This is dumb. What's happening? Doc Jones got to me. Was like Doc, how's everybody doing? They're doing fine. You're doing good. We're gonna get you out here. My Lieutenant came over Lieutenant nailer they started working on my wounds. Senior Airman stone air for another Air Force dude, he was calming me down. You know? I gotta tell you, Stoney. We call him Stoney Stoney. He, I he kept to himself he was reserved with everybody you know a very I don't want to say pasa but he was just to himself. That dude, I did not hear him stop talking. And I gotta tell you that's one guy I always wonder where the hell he's at now because like he just he would just keep me calm make sure I don't go into shock.

Mike Failace: 44:28

I was gonna say we're zooming painted this pain involved in this just adrenaline and shock or Yeah, I'd say

Unknown: 44:33

adrenaline a little bit of shock. Like I just started going they got me on a letter my interpreter that I was telling you about who's still over there returning it back. Him and an Afghan police officer they all help get me on a letter and they carried me over behind one of the bigger vehicles em wraps for cover. And when they carried me over, they I'm like I said unconscious and coherent of just trying to make sure I don't wake out. They carried me right past to body bye X, and those bodies backs their body armor around it and right next to our vehicle I knew exactly what the fuck it was. And fortunately it was. It was Major Scott Haggerty is Stillwater, Oklahoma. The gentleman took my vehicle, which is why I'm still here today. And specialists Dara, Colin of Windgap, Pennsylvania, he was driving the vehicle that day. And Derek was only 20 years old. He was the youngest in our platoon. Evie, she just turned 20, actually two months prior.

Kevin Donaldson: 45:29

So when did you find out the full extent of the damage? Of what you went through the damage on you?

Unknown: 45:38

Well, I, you know, have to say I, before we get there, there was a moment that I always like to talk about. Another person was wounded that day. And his it was the Afghan governor who was in the backseat of our vehicle. And the two of us got on a Black Hawk and be with us. That got on that Black Hawk with an Afghan police officer who wasn't wounded. He was there to escort the the governor. And when we got to Bagram Airbase, my first visitor ever was this Afghan police officer and he walks into my room, stands up straight, big smile, he puts his hand over his heart and he starts talking, he doesn't even I can speak English. We all know body language. And I look I say this right now, because my unit never went through something like this. But there are situations that we call blue and green, where maybe the Afghan police or the Afghan military, we're working with them every day, the same people, individuals, and one just decides to go rogue and start shooting us. So always don't trust them don't trust this combat system that for this gentleman to walk in and greet me just to see how I'm doing. I don't know who this guy is we like but we all know body language, right? That's the way the Afghans Greek. That's why they say hello, smile, and they do that. Man, I gotta tell you that will always stick with me. That moment right there. Because it made me realize I'm 24 years old at this time of my life. And I'll trust the scumbags. And I'm like, it was a little bit of eye opener where, you know, I hope this isn't political. But we look at a few bad apples in law enforcement and all of a sudden society looks at all as bad. You know, how simple minded can people be? You know, I was looking at the Afghan millet Afghan police as they're all bad, because a few bad apples. What do you think's going on in America right now?

Kevin Donaldson: 47:31

Well, it's

Mike Failace: 47:32

700,000 cops in the world in America, and five of them are blaming us for the five bed bugs that are out there.

Kevin Donaldson: 47:39

I've said this before on this show. We're all judged by our lowest common denominator. And that is universal. And you're right. You're telling me it's universal? Yes, there's some bad Afghani police officers. But there are some good ones too. Absolutely. There's some bad soldiers. There's some good ones too.

Unknown: 47:54

I always say law enforcement. Today's present law enforcement is the Vietnam veteran from 50 years ago, it's it's one of the charities, I'll get into it later. It's why we started working with cops. And China because like, as a, as a, as a disabled veteran. I don't even like to use that word, as a guy who's heard overseas and serving the military. You know, there's so many charities out there for us like they're real. It's, I feel blessed. I really do feel blessed. But we look at law enforcement. You know, we look at our first responders. We look at what happened on 911 The whole reason why I feel like you know, the beginning of the global war on terror that must be real here that our first casualties in the first warriors of Iraq and Afghanistan. Now, meanwhile, I feel like everything I have is taken care of. But our first responders, Jon Stewart shouldn't have to go down to Congress and say, Why are we not taking care of those that were taken out that pile? Does that make sense? Yes, absolutely. You know,

Mike Failace: 48:53

they know exactly where you're coming from. Yep. And it's just

Unknown: 48:55

it's, that's why I always feel blessed. I always feel blessed that uh, oh, my God, you lost your leg in Afghanistan. Here's five bucks on a fucking house. You know, like, it's, it's Wow, it's just, I feel very blessed,

Mike Failace: 49:07

wounded, Wounded Warrior Project and all that. They

Kevin Donaldson: 49:10

there is one place in this local area. They're one of our gracious sponsors. And I got to show I gotta throw a shout out to him. So it's grant saloon and Clifton, they treat police first responders vets, they treat us like gold. And that's 940 van Houghton Avenue in Clifton. Those are the places and those are the people that surround themselves that yes, while there are some bad optics on police, those are the people that make it all worth it because at least somebody's saying, Yeah, right. At least somebody's saying, you know, so you're you're laying up in this hospital bed. And what was the decision was the leg did it have to go or was it? Well, we could try to save it. Is that one of those things?

Unknown: 49:52

Well, it was. I went under for surgery in Afghanistan, doing surgery on my right hip. The next thing I remember nurses pulling my hair anything to about and as I calm down she lets me know that I am in launch Hill airbase in Ramstein, Germany. That's yeah.

Kevin Donaldson: 50:10

So you went to sleep in Bagram? Yep.

Unknown: 50:12

I woke up in Germany. Exactly. Now apparently I was awake before we took that flight over there. But so at this point, my higher command is seeing how in seeing me in Bagram and seeing how I'm doing, I guess I was up, I was talking to him. Somebody said, You were joking. Google's your dudes are career, right? And it's like, I don't remember any of that shit. But waking up in Germany. The doctor comes in that day, and says, we think we could save your right but your left leg. It looks like you're gonna have to get an amputated and I actually asked the doctor I was like, you think I could keep it? And it's like, well did it if you keep it you're in a wheelchair crutches the rest of your Listen to me, Doc. Do you think I could keep it? In a jar? Yeah. And you know when he says no, like there's no fucking No, nothing more mine. Like, you know, when Holyfield got his ear bitten. I hope he got that shit pack

Kevin Donaldson: 51:13

and gave it back. Did you see the commercials?

Unknown: 51:17

But nowadays he said I actually what are you gonna do with the DAC is like all you do is we're sitting right it was like what a fuckin waste a prop that is right there. Like you probably bring it home with your dog. right doc like having to toilet my booth back anyway.

Kevin Donaldson: 51:30

You're speaking engagements. How great would that be? You come in on the table. You think you had a bad day? What that was was just somebody somebody starts tackling in the crowd, you kick them? Have a little fun with it, you know? But you know, it's the way you're approaching this the way you're even talking about it. And we're just into is amazing. Because now after the leg, you found that the leg had to go right? Was there a little bit of depression? Or was this attitude the whole time?

Unknown: 52:02

I gotta say with confidence. Look, I want you to picture this. If I did an escort major Haggerty that day, I would have been killed. Every day, I sat in that seat unless I was escorting major hierdie every fucking day. So like, I'm trying to like, Dude, this is not going to fucking let you down. That's just like, dude, this can't this can't can let you down. Just can't do it. Don't get me wrong. I had my moments. And I think we all do we all do. Yeah, like I wasn't abused. At least. You know, man, like, no leg. Yeah, exactly. You know, like I do. But there was moments where I'm like, thinking like, the guys overseas, like, I remember, like, this is the days of MySpace. And I sent my buddies MySpace messages like, Man, I wish I was still there. You know, like, I wish I was there with you guys. Because you gotta remember my rack deployment is the people I was with, which made me want to volunteer. Sometimes in Germany, like, I was there for about three or four days, I believe. And eventually, June of 2008, I finally went back to the state's Walter Reed Army Medical Center, and this is going to be my home for a while. And one by one. I would get visitors like three days in ICU. And they would have to visit me one at a time. Like they would just wait in the hallway want to come in one come on out in person, my mom that my dad and so on. So and then there was my brother. And I remember, George was saying to me at one point like, like, I should have just gone with you. Like what? Like, dude, don't think that man and I even when I tried to humor him, I was like, Look, man, I gotta tell you, it's Don't think like that. You're just going to drive yourself crazy. Like I'm here. Right? You know, it's like, like, in the moment in Afghanistan. I didn't know. Like, when this initially happened, like Joe, I, I didn't know what was gonna happen, how things were gonna be, but I'm still here. And I'm even saying a doc like Docs is everything like, am I going to, like, we're gonna be alright. It's like, Dude, you're gonna be fine, man. I was like, What? Are you? Okay, I'm good. I'm good. I'm good. Three, okay. But like, in that moment, like, with Joe, no matter what humor I gave him. It just wasn't gonna happen.

Kevin Donaldson: 54:13

And which is what you were afraid of? If he went on that second deployment, how

Unknown: 54:17

it works like that, doesn't it?

Mike Failace: 54:18

We know we I mean, we've had people in here before that would military experience. And they said like, when they went home, they actually almost regretted going home because they felt like they were leaving their their troops behind. You know, he felt like they were bailed out on. It's something

Unknown: 54:33

I don't know what it is with that culture, man. But the things you experienced the stupid downtime, like you said, Guys got in trouble.

Kevin Donaldson: 54:41

Yeah. And that's it's across the board. That's from a world war two vet. Right, you know, and it's happening in every major conflict. But normally we

Mike Failace: 54:47

had the sniper in here. Yeah. And he could he couldn't go back anymore. And he said he used to cry at night, thinking that he loved. He loved everybody let everybody down. And I think

Unknown: 54:57

there's also I feel like is the ship You're in the danger sometimes that you put yourself in because it wasn't every day. Like it wasn't, you know, that I'll be I'll be relevant. I didn't see a lot of action from boltless deployments. You know, I'll be real, but I saw enough where I could have a cool stories.

Kevin Donaldson: 55:15

But sounds like Joe had what's called survivor guilt. Right? And he wasn't even there. Well, that's, that's the part of it.

Unknown: 55:22

I gotta I gotta tell you Joe's personality. Joe is he's very Joe is like, he's a lot better soldier than I was. I'm not saying I was bad. He was just very good at what he did. And anybody who served him one night in that era, who knew Joe and myself and especially at Alpha Company and on sale, you guys out there listening? Everybody knew Joe was like, just top notch. And I was just, maybe you could say average. I learned a lot about myself and growing. But I mean, I would just say you know, laid back guy call me girl like we all know I'm in charge call me or I'll do like, relax. You know, you're on the comics Archer Granville, but it's just how it was. But I'm going to tell you my time at Walter Reed. I learned how to walk again. Things were good things were great. Like I learned how to snowboard, again was special prosthetic leg. I learned how to play sled hockey for a team called the USA warriors like what's good. Then I'm medically retired and got out of the army. And I got a job in Washington DC as an archaeology lab technician. And on my weekends I would go and a week before Christmas in 2010. I'm getting ready for this black tie event with the girl I'm dating at the time. I get out of the shower. I put my prosthetic and suit pants and a T shirt on before I get fully dressed in front of the mirror. Do my hair, the phone rings, let it go to voicemail I finished doing my hair. Wash it, wash my hands. I will go grab my phone. I look at my phone sees my mom. I listened to the voicemail. And she sounds very distraught in the end. Earl, you need to call me immediately. What's that about? Right? So I give her a buzz back? She picks up the phone and she says my name so ever somber. Now, what's up? Like her? I'm so sorry, Mom. What's going on? URL? Mom, deep breath. Talk to me what's up? While Joe was on active duty, he took his own life. Or stay in my life guys. I'm sure you know, how do I get this second chance at life and have Joe take his away. The next day I go to Joe's house. There's his wife, there's this kids. There's some of our friends that we served with. There's our friends growing up there. Joe was a corrections officer before he went active duty in the National Guard. Each unit has people who are on active duty. And before he was active, he was the CEO some of the seal buddies were there. And you can imagine the energy in this house and I'm just like, Man, I don't want to be like this. Alright, so Alright, what happens now guys? Okay, so Tomorrow is Monday. The 20th Somebody's gonna be at the armory. I know. It's like close to Christmas. Okay, perfect. I took my cousin Paul and my best friend growing up Dave Rivera, who both served in the guard as well. We went up to the armory. There's my old Iranian Sensio Staff Sergeant Peterson. I give he gives me a hug and condolences. I take a box from him. There's Joe's desk. I empty out his desk pass done. Now what? Okay, let's fill out the paperwork for the funeral. Boom, that's done. What's next? I need you go work with supply and it's going to be an open casket so I'll make sure Joe's in his dress uniform, his military dress uniform. And make sure all awards are up to date. Make sure that happens. You I might Joe's wife's Catholic, I need you to go work with St. Rose church in Carbondale to work all the logistics with stuff for that. Okay, boom, get that done. And I need you to come with me to help when my mother pick out a casket priest funeral home in Carbondale, and I just started delegating all these tasks and not really processing exactly what the fuck is going on. I knew what happened. I know Joe's gone, but I'm just like, Alright, let's get all this done. Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

Mike Failace: 58:53

You had supervisor mode.

Unknown: 58:54

Yeah, and it just it the next in eventually day Joe's funeral, I got my dress blues. I walked up to that casket. I give him the final salute. And that's that.

Kevin Donaldson: 59:06

But eventually, when everything quiets down, that's when the danger happens. Absolutely.

Unknown: 59:11

That's you fucking now that.

Kevin Donaldson: 59:15

You see this, you see this across the board, not only with military, you know, when I watched this, to a much lesser degree, obviously. But I watched this with my grandmother, my grandfather was sick and he was dying. And everybody's focused on him. Everybody's focused, she's focused on him. We're focused on him. And he passes. And then at the funeral, when everything quiets down, I look over at my grandmother. My grandmother is really sick. She's really sick to the point where she'd probably got only another couple months to live, we get our medical attention and she she lives quite a while longer, but that's what happens. You're hyper focused on one thing, and then when, when everything's done, like, oh,

Mike Failace: 59:56

forget about the pieces that were around it. Yep,

Unknown: 59:59

dust settles I have no purpose. My I never really thought about what was next. After this. I knew I wanted to go back to college. I was working in DC and like, what the fuck happens now? What do we do now? What happens like, my, I there was nothing to live for I felt like and I it wasn't like I was gonna live for I'm gonna kill myself No, it wasn't like that. But I just like I didn't know what was next and my mindset went right back to playing the victim. Or I'm sorry, it went right back to like when I first joined the military. I wasn't making it all about me once again, like when I said I joined for college when I joined the military, but now I'm making it all about me but in a whole different realm. And not just by playing the fucking victim. feeling sorry for myself thinking the world owes me everything. Let me ask you guys something. Where's playing a victim getting in life? Yeah,

Mike Failace: 1:00:46

nowhere. Exactly. I tried. You know, deep hole I tried

Kevin Donaldson: 1:00:49

for quite a while to play the victim and it did not work out so doesn't get you

Mike Failace: 1:00:53

anywhere. It's just like having a shovel. You're gonna keep digging that hole deeper and deeper. Yeah, keep playing the victim, you're just gonna get down in that hole and you're never gonna get out of it.

Unknown: 1:01:02

I basically turned into uncle Rico. You know, like I like my mind is in the past is my glory days as a great football player. Maybe cowboys will get a ring with him. That's that's where my mindset went. And I just lived in the past I was that guy at the bar with my dog tags out. You know what I did for Mike? Like I was at shithead. I was actually you know, and I'm, I have not made friends saying this, like this dysfunctional veteran attitude. I feel like my generation of veterans have. It's fucking bullshit. Look, man, you got to thrive. All this, like traumas going to happen in your life. But it does not have to define who the fuck you are. And I had to find that out. It wasn't like overnight, this should happen. My mindset got like this, there was a lot of falling down, there was a lot of just self destruction, and just destroying myself,

Mike Failace: 1:01:54

you're not just gonna snap out of it. Right? You can't just snap out of it, you have to work your way out of it.

Kevin Donaldson: 1:02:00

Well, instead of an elephant in this room, we actually had to say that we actually have a cinderblock in this room. And I'm so I'm gonna go I'm going to assume that that has something to do with your new purpose.

Unknown: 1:02:13

Well, life is purpose. It really is. If you don't have purpose, you're gonna fucking fall apart. You What is your legacy going to be? What do we start with? All right, and I like it. Because I truly believe you know, what led me to where I'm at now was the motivation, I feel like was somebody telling me your brother was just proud of things you were doing? Like, I was very athletic. I was pushing myself when I initially first lost my leg. And it was the people around me to Walter Reed, it was full of men and women like me like this. And I'm seeing people with much more injuries, much more worse injuries than me thriving. And that was like, like, that sounds so bad. You know, why can't I be like, exactly, you know, and that right? There was like a big push, just people like, you know, you you become the people you surround yourself with and who I was surrounding myself with, which is like everybody there at Walter Reed. They were just like, oh, let's do this. Let's do that. Let's be active. Walter Reed was a great place. And it still is, you know, I still get to prosthetics but I lost all that when Joe died. You know, I didn't know what was next and I got involved in Spartan Races got involved in CrossFit. I joined organizations like operation during worry this organization right here. I feel like they ended up I met them in a Spartan Race and their mission is to honor power motivate one of the disabled veterans to stay active.

Kevin Donaldson: 1:03:30

So we're I want to put up a little bit lower third Operation Enduring warrior we're gonna we're gonna put some links to those in our show notes. Be great. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah,

Unknown: 1:03:38

check us out. We're not just military man. We were recently something we talked about earlier in the show. We just started working with law enforcement because how society looks at the law enforcement culture, few bad apples inside society, it's all them. And the new Viet I like to call it the new Vietnam veteran, is how society looks at our our law enforcement nowadays. So anyway, I, I met these individuals and they helped me get through a Spartan Race and meeting them that day. I met the rest of the team, each person that's wearing a uniform, and a little they have a little soul pack. They're all current and former military, and they helped me through the Spartan Race. And before we took off on that race, they all donned a gas mask. And I was like, You guys are hardcore man. After the race. He asked me what do you think about joining us? Well, you don't just join you have to earn a spot. You gotta get blooded. Absolutely. Yeah, to go through an induction and you know, now it's, let's, it's safe to say I threw my end DAC in 2014. Half my class didn't make it. And but it was a biggest kick in the ass I needed. It wasn't a bunch of people like, you could do it. Or like, you know, let's help you get through this. Like,

Mike Failace: 1:04:46

it's not the good Trier's club. No, it was it was it was

Unknown: 1:04:50

like you know, I remember there was a during an evolution, I'm struggling and I want to ask a question to like, and I like drinking with these guys like weeks before when I went through The Spartan Race of them. And I remember Scott Blau just like I want to go say something he said Get the fuck away from me. And I'm like, Wow. You know, but that's it was very military life. Like they said each person is current or former military. Where's that mass now also law enforcement. And this kills my life with purpose. Once again, now I have a mission. I'm helping men and women in situations like mine who's missing a leg reach their goals, of dealing with their disability and not letting their disability define who they are, they're gonna find themselves and we're doing it together as a team, just like in the military. And I realized as human beings military law enforcement on campus, you know who you are civilian, you all need three P's in your lives. You must have a purpose. What do you wake up for? To do every day? Yep. Also, what is your passion? What do you wake up for, for yourself? Like an example physical fitness is huge passion of mine is very important to me challenging myself physically. And I fucking love dogs who doesn't love dogs right? part of something bigger than yourself these organizations I work for, you know, it's the power of what community can do and that right there community's gonna go to my three recipes. I believe we all need to find those three Pete's attitude. So like I said before that dysfunctional veteran attitude it's gonna get you nowhere in life.

Kevin Donaldson: 1:06:19

I missed the last p by the way,

Unknown: 1:06:20

part of something bigger, something okay. part of something bigger than yourself. Purpose, passion part of something. And then there's attitude is the first recipe to find those three P's like a good attitude. You're going to need that in your life. Yeah, because that that dysfunctional veteran bad attitude is gonna get you nowhere defeatist attitude. Right? Exactly. Yeah, you're just gonna fall apart. Like you lost before you even started. You think the Eagles when they're gonna win the Super Bowl? You know, do you think they're gonna go in there with a bad attitude? No, you're gonna fucking

Kevin Donaldson: 1:06:48

Yeah, we are because we're Eagles fans. Fans? Yeah, we all got bad attitudes.

Mike Failace: 1:06:52

You know, it's funny. One of the quotes I heard back in the days, if you think you can't, you're right. That's 100%. Right. And if you think you think you can't, you're right. Do you think

Kevin Donaldson: 1:07:04

you're right? That's a that's a great quote. Where can our audience find you? Because you got a hell of a health store? No, no kidding.

Unknown: 1:07:13

Two more recipes now telling you that attitude comfort zone, you have to step out of it. And then third community those three right there. So purpose, passion part of something. And

Kevin Donaldson: 1:07:25

that's he just nailed it. Like everything you just said is the things that saved our lives, which is our group group therapy, but it's just like minded individuals, looking searching for all of those points that you just made.

Unknown: 1:07:38

Think about who you surround yourself with, too. And what I mean like a fucked up dude, I

Kevin Donaldson: 1:07:42

don't know if you want to

Unknown: 1:07:44

Well, and it's you know, then like I said, attitude, comfort zone, community, the rest of file a three piece and then I know we talked about this, and I want to talk I do want to talk about this what's in the represent time? Yep. What Cindy represents because her name is Anita cinderblock. Yep, sending the cinder block now to Oregon to other organizations I work for

Kevin Donaldson: 1:08:03

little hole in there is

Unknown: 1:08:07

warrior strong and the Oscar Mike foundation to charities that are very like both help keeps health and wellness keep wounded veterans act will take Cindy out on the course with us, okay. And I'll start off with her of whatever race we're doing. And she gets pretty heavy after a while. But luckily, I have a team a community to help carry this. So I don't carry it by myself. We're carrying it together. It's a reminder for the same the bullshit we deal up in here. We're gonna get in our heads once in a while. But sometimes that community carry the wait and give us a kick in the ass to say, Dude, you don't have to care they should alone. I mean, it's just like that Iraq deployment, I realized the power of what community could do during COVID look at when a community came into play to make sure the small businesses don't close. It's not about me, it's not about you. It's about us

Kevin Donaldson: 1:08:54

sometimes you need a smack on the back or smack in the face whatever one you need at the time around jugular but did you just tell me that you share Cindy with all your all your friends your little

Unknown: 1:09:09

Look man, I've been doing this for years and I have never ever

Mike Failace: 1:09:13

put that in my head before. So the next time guess what

Kevin Donaldson: 1:09:16

the next time you hand Cindy off to one of your friends you're gonna be like that fucking Kevin's right.

Unknown: 1:09:28

Look, dude, communities it and the people you surround yourself with too, is what's going to make or break you.

Kevin Donaldson: 1:09:35

Or we're coming to the end of this thing here and I try to end the show with he got such a great attitude. I tried to end the show with the same point in the same question. You my friend have gone through several different levels of suffering several different levels of hell. What do you think it's taught you? What do you think? What what do you think it's taught you?

Unknown: 1:09:58

Stop doubting yourself Stop it.

Mike Failace: 1:10:02

So you all we all have inner strength. Yeah, reach in and get that inner strength.

Unknown: 1:10:06

And I think there's moments in your life where you may doubt yourself. I do it sometimes once in a while, but, you know, sometimes I just realized, like, I think of things you've achieved before in the past, okay? Anybody out there, think of things you achieved, there may have been a moment where you didn't think you were gonna achieve that, but you did at some point. And you're like, Fuck, I just did that. I want you to keep that in your mind and in your life, all the time. When you're about to tackle something new stepping out of your comfort zone. Hey, you may fail. But that's okay. What do you do with that shit? You look good with his BA circuit? Is it bad attitude? Once you sit there, shift that around and like, Okay, put this shit in my toolbox? What the fuck do I do with this? Now? How do I tackle this next time I do it? What am I going to do differently?

Kevin Donaldson: 1:10:52

So one of the tools that that's helpful for me, is whenever I get down about something, or whenever something doesn't go my way, I give myself a finite time to be a victim. finite time. Okay, you got five minutes, you got 10 minutes. And I'll listen, I'll beat the shit out of myself in that 10 minutes. It's amazing how much damage I could do it in 10 minutes. And when 10 minutes is up. All right. Let's time to turn it around to grind. It's time to get going because it isn't staying here is not going to do me anything. Right?

Mike Failace: 1:11:21

You know what one question I used to ask myself all the time. And that's how I got through a lot of it is think about what it could have been? Right? What happened to you? If you weren't sitting in that seat? Think of how it could have been. You might not have been here now.

Kevin Donaldson: 1:11:40

I'm certainly glad glad that you're here. We all

Mike Failace: 1:11:42

have salutely. And you got a great story to tell. And you're going to help a lot of people and I'm sure you're helping a lot of people as it is anyway. I appreciate you. I told you in the very beginning. I'm not worthy. I'm definitely not worthy. Absolutely not.

Kevin Donaldson: 1:11:54

If there's anything we learn is to be an Eagles fan.

Unknown: 1:11:57

Go Eagles, fly Eagles fly.

Kevin Donaldson: 1:12:00

Thank you so much for joining us to

Mike Failace: 1:12:01

learn to stay off of Broad Street when the Eagles went

Kevin Donaldson: 1:12:05

out of Philly, out of Pennsylvania. Thank you so much for joining us today. It's been wonderful. It's been amazing. And I can't wait to see what you're going to do in the future.

Unknown: 1:12:14

Thank you gentlemen, check me out Earl granville.org or granville.org, we'll

Kevin Donaldson: 1:12:17

put you on we'll put links to all your media, all your social media, all your stuff on our website, or on our show notes here. And that's going to do it for this episode of the suffering podcast the suffering of a warrior with Earl Granville and as always let's think about all the stuff that we learned today. What are you leaving on the table? If a 50 caliber James have a cannon in reserve? Passion makes this country great. playing the victim will get you nowhere. What's next, and what's your legacy? But most importantly, purpose, passion part of something bigger than yourself. And that's going to do it for this episode. Follow us on all social media tick tock LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram. Follow Mike at Mike underscore Falaise. Follow me at real Kevin Donaldson and of course, follow the suffering podcast. Don't forget you can always listen before you watch all of our audio episodes come out on Sunday. And that's gonna do it for this episode. We'll see you next time.